You’ve Been Served - Conference Follow-Up
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Following-up the 4/28/2009 Job Loss & Child Support Modification Update - the conference was completed and I made a beeline for the van. There was more work to do. With only 2-weeks until the hearing, I had to act quickly and since I didn’t have the children or DW with me, I had the time to do it. Nice day. No interruptions. Might as well run all over town while I could.
I’ve had my own suspicions of PEW regarding “hidden income” which I’ve mentioned previously. Psycho-SIL has been living with PEW and the children for quite a while now. Over a year. I’m doubting highly that she has been living there for free. It’s also the reason I believe she didn’t press the child support issue sooner, despite an ongoing pattern of threats. You see, even at an assumed “family-discount” rent rate, added to her regular job’s net income, the amount of child support I have been paying is about right in-line with what I would have been paying all along - given that I would have (again) made an issue of it and it would have come out in court. So, all of her parroting about “giving me a break” on the child support, aside from being false for previously mentioned reasons, is also a farce for this one.
Back in 2005 when I raised the issue of Psycho-SIL moving in with PEW for serious reasons related to her untreated bi-polar disorder and child support calculations, PEW had her “move-out.” Of course, after the custody order and child support order were calculated and set in stone, Psycho-SIL promptly moved right back in. Looky there! PEW working the system for her own financial benefit again!
Well, aside from the fact that Lacey, the support master, didn’t ask PEW about any additional income, I chose not to bring this issue up, either. Save it for the hearing.
Which brings me to errand #1. I drove home, took care of a few loose ends, and promptly returned to the court building with a couple of hours. I downloaded a subpoena to “produce documents and things.” Filed it with the court and got it signed, stamped with the official court seal, and was off to do errand #2. What do I want PEW to produce? Her last 12-months of bank records, receipts, cancelled checks, and any other documents that demonstrate how much Psycho-SIL is paying for rent at PEW’s home.
Which brings me to errand #2. This one would be a little more difficult. Serving PEW with the subpoena. This is something I do NOT recommend others do. In the past, I’ve always gotten someone else to do the service. This time, I didn’t have the time to put something together and I didn’t want to wait a week to do so. My out? She requested a copy of my tax return for 2008. I told her that I would not provide her with anything that she didn’t first provide me with from her side. She promptly emailed me a copy of hers. So, in keeping with my promise to her, I called her up, told her I had some errands to run and was it okay for me to swing by her workplace to hand-deliver it. I could meet her out front. Her first reply was, “Well, uh, you’re not going to gun me down in the parking lot or anything like that are you?” Gee, that never gets old. I laughed at her and said, “Absolutely not. I don’t have a fax machine and I have to pass by your workplace on the way to other errands anyway.” She agreed to meet.
So, I folded the subpoena in with the copy of the tax return, wrote her name on the envelope, and drove the few minutes to her office where she was waiting outside. She approached my open window and I handed her the envelope with the obligatory, “Here’s the copy of the tax return you requested. Oh. And you’ve been served.” With that, I drove off.
Which brings me to errand #3. Off I drove to the courthouse in the neighboring county to pull up on the computer and print out some records regarding PEW’s foreclosure. She was able to avoid losing the home back in October, though we’re unclear how. I’m also not sure what help these documents will provide, except that if she should choose to lie under oath about it, she’ll have some explaining to do as to why she had her sister living with her all that time, contributing nothing financially to the household, while she failed to pay her mortgage for many months. Looking through the foreclosure documents, however, one thing does stand out. They were served on her sister, at the PEW’s home address, signed, sealed, and delivered. One of the documents in the packet was the evidence of service by the Sheriff’s Department.
From there, I drove home to DW.
When I arrived home, the only “backlash” I got was this email from PEW:
LM,
This is not a complete tax return LM….and does me no good. That’s ok though, I’ll have the attorney subpoena the rest of your stuff.
~PEW
It was page 1 and page 2, absent all the other schedules. That’s all she needs. She’s looking for the hidden income. She has a copy of my W-2. If she matches it to the tax return, she’ll see that’s all I made and all I claimed. She’s not too bright.
Next installment: I have a consultation with my attorney.
April 30th, 2009 at 4:54 am
SNAAAAP!
Love the way you served her.
My husband’s PEW also seems to always have a problem with only receiving page 1 and 2 of his tax return…even though she’s NEVER provided hers. She’s always screaming that he’s hiding something, like millions of dollars of extra income…yet his W-2 matches his tax return exactly.
Funny how they like to fantasize, huh?
April 30th, 2009 at 6:33 am
I am a big fan of “self service”, although I am fully aware of the possible dangers. When DH served our PEW it was comical to watch her wide eyed, deer caught in the headlights look as she turned the envelope over and over in her hands without actually opening it.
One thing is certain, I should have brought a video camera!
April 30th, 2009 at 7:00 am
[...] Next installment: You’ve Been Served. [...]
April 30th, 2009 at 4:06 pm
lmao. How on earth did you keep from laughing!?
April 30th, 2009 at 4:31 pm
I have been following this saga for quite a while and I am now finally and completely convinced who is the “psycho” in this relationship.
You are thriving on the drama and the unhappiness that you are causing. How on earth can you be so wrapped up in your own world that you cannot see how ridiculous it is for you and how damaging for your children to persist in all this conflict?
Going after her for child support when she is barely making it and you know that? You and DW were disappointed that she did not lose her house?
April 30th, 2009 at 5:32 pm
Wizard must have never involved with a true PEW. I have had the misfortune of having a PEW in my life, so I know EXACTLY what LM and DW are going through.
April 30th, 2009 at 5:53 pm
The sad reality that Wizard of Id is failing to recognize is that the father (me) and children have suffered immeasurably over the course of many, many years at the hands of PEW’s efforts.
I am absolutely NOT disappointed she didn’t lose her house. I certainly don’t want her to lose her house. After all, I’ve contributed substantially to it since she obtained it.
I’m not “going after her” for child support. I want the statutes to be applied fairly no matter who is making more money. I think the child support calculations are terrible. However, they are what they are.
Interesting that Wizard of Id has (apparently) absolutely zero concern that we may soon be in the same boat… and yet, PEW is unwilling to accept the reality of the situation and wants MORE child support than the statutes seem to indicate she is entitled to.
Ahhh… but I have a penis between my legs, and we all know how prevailing opinion in this society seems to be that if you have a penis, you pay. If you have a vagina, you don’t.
My going for an appropriate and legal adjustment to the current child support situation is not persisting in the conflict. PEW’s fighting it based on the fact that she is a woman and, despite now having the greater income - shouldn’t be contributing her “fair share” to ensure that the children are taken care of.
Why do people like Wizard of Id consistently wear their bias on their sleeve? Are mothers somehow not responsible for the financial well-being of their children when they’re required to?
April 30th, 2009 at 7:14 pm
“You are thriving on the drama and the unhappiness that you are causing.”
…huh….say it again….
“…DRAMA…UNHAPPINESS….YOU ARE CAUSING….”
Wizard you have NOT A SINGLE CLUE of what you speak!
April 30th, 2009 at 8:49 pm
Mister-M - As a mother (and step-mother), I live both worlds as DW does. I KNOW that good fathers (like you) provide well beyond what the statues deem is fair. It is the few fathers that don’t provide for their kids (financially and emotionally) that ruin it for everyone. PEWs seem to think that providing for the kids means you MUST provide for the mother. That is not the case at all. As a mother myself, I provide 100% for myself, and 54% for my kids (per income guidelines). I actually provide a lot more than 54%, but I am happy just to get enough to keep the kids stable. My kids are happy and well adjusted, and thriving in school. They aren’t perfect, but considering all things they are doing quite well. If I took the same attitude as the PEWs of the world, I would be getting thousands more in “child support” which I could use to put away for college, but is much better used for my ex to feed my kids on the one day they spend with him. My current husband gets very little of his net pay due to his PEW refusing to get a job. Now that he is in the same situation as you (and nearly 15% of the people), he doesn’t have much to give. They are in the midst of evaluation, but his support is still paid ahead by a month even at the higher rate (leaves him almost nothing to live on). His PEW called him first thing this morning wanting to know where “her” money was, because she hadn’t gotten anything for a while (2 weeks). I guess she didn’t listen to the 10 times he told her to budget carefully as the new pay schedule isn’t like the old one, and she needs to provide for herself for a while. We figure the last day of the month hit and she hasn’t paid the rent yet, so probably going to get another eviction notice. Like your kids, his kids have been moved 4 times in the past 4 years. Let’s just say as much as we love the kids, the PEWs influence has caused them some serious laziness (to say the least). At least in our case, his PEW refuses to work and has no family, so no money for lawyers. We are getting ready to get our lawyer back for round two in court, and this time I will have copies of her identity theft conviction for stealing my husband’s mother’s identity. Her defense to that was that she needed to buy medicine for the kids as my husband was abandoning them. Hmm…guess she forgot about the insurance he paid for 100% and the medications he also paid 100% for. At least the prosecutor saw the charges she made on the credit card, of which none had to do with medication for children. What a moron!
May 1st, 2009 at 5:52 pm
I have a borderline mother, and her illness is stronger than I am. If I engage in drama or conflict with her, I will always lose. The only way I win is if I focus on my own life and spend my time on things that benefit me. My mother also owes me lots of money, and it sucks that I will never see it again, but I have to let it go. It’s only money, and my sanity is more important.
I think that what you’re describing here has a high probability of backfiring on you. Driving out of your way to serve a subpoena= attention, drama, conflict, excitement!!!!!
You may be doing exactly what she wants you to do. If she is really a borderline, the child support money might be a lot less important to her than the excitement of a court hearing where she will get to repeat all her accusations in front of an audience.
May 1st, 2009 at 9:09 pm
So….he lost his job and is struggling….the law says in his situation he gets relief from child support…. BUT he should not pursue this because she is borderline?
He should not have filed, and just kept paying money he doesn’t have, or he should have accepted an increase that they tried to push through, or he should just accept her lies that she will use to attempt to cause him further financial hardship and not use the subpoena that is available specifically to prevent her from doing this?….because pursing all this will create drama in her otherwise happy, stable, well adjusted existence.
I have a PEW and I can tell you that I choose my battles to minimize the impact on me and the kids. But make no mistake my presence and actions or lack there of are not required for her drama. Her whole daily existence is drama. Unfortunately there are some issues serious enough that I am forced to participate in her drama.
It would seem to me that getting relief from MANDATORY CHILD SUPPORT, THAT IS COLLECTED UNDER PENALTY OF INCARCERATION, that you are no longer able to pay is a battle worth fighting….the drama is inevitable.
Astrid you loaned her money and you will not get it back…ok that was your choice and it is unfortunate, this hardly compares to the situation Mister-M is in.
May 3rd, 2009 at 11:27 pm
I think that Mr M should file for a child support change, but he definitely should not have served the ex himself — that’s inviting drama. I also think that re-opening all the issues from the past (where the sister was living in 2005, etc.) is likely to be a total waste of time because the court has presumably heard about all that and made its ruling for the initial child support order. A court won’t open issues that were resolved by a prior court unless there’s a very, very good reason.
The issue is simple — Mr M’s income has changed. That’s all he has to prove. He doesn’t have to worry about 2005 or whether the ex is making money on the side or what happened in a past foreclosure. All he has to show the court is what his income is now.
The ex tried to change the argument by going on about hidden income and dead dogs. If Mr M chooses to spend his time on these side issues, he’s playing his ex’s game. He’ll open his can of worms, and she’ll open 10,000 cans. It will backfire and be a waste of time.
The ex may be hiding money. She may be running a meth lab on the side and making millions. She may be renting rooms to boarders. My advice is to let all that go. It makes no sense to spend all your time researching your ex’s life to prove she’s a liar. Live your own life and spend your time on the people you love.
And, yes, if you choose to marry and have children with a borderline, she’s probably going to hide income and take more child support than she should. I think it’s a small price to pay for getting away with your sanity. Your ex will be out of your life in 18 years or sooner. Your children will live with her forever.
May 4th, 2009 at 9:35 am
Some of what Astrid says is very true, however, Astrid, you’re misreading my intentions.
Unless you’ve been a father in CS support court, you have no idea the ringer you can be run through when it comes to false, completely unsupportable claims of “hidden income.” I have no choice but to fight those claims.
Further, when calculating CS, all income must be considered. I’m certainly not intending to attempt to go back and litigate the past, that’s not my problem nor will the court entertain that (as you said).
However, if we’re both required to put all current cards on the table, then the income she receives from her boarder must be taken into account.
As for service… I almost always recommend never serving the other party yourself. In this case, it was simply a matter of convenience because I had to drop off the copy of the tax return anyway and simply tucked the subpoena in with it.
May 4th, 2009 at 11:50 am
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