You Have Saved Our Sanity!
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Dear DW and LM,
My husband and I just want to thank you for promoting the “low contact” strategy.
For 8 years we have been documenting, documenting, documenting, but we were always at a loss when it came to conversations with BM on the phone. As taping conversations without her knowing is illegal in our state, the rages she would have were always our word against hers. After starting to read your website, a few months ago DH put his foot down after she went off on him on the phone. He told her he wasn’t going to take her verbal abuse anymore, and that he would only be contacting her by email. When the phone rings he lets it go straight to voicemail. Now we finally have recordings of her raging - she actually did it on voicemail and in about 6 emails.
I think she must have talked to someone who wised her up, though, because now she says she has no internet service and DH “has” to talk to her on the phone. DH responded in a letter, which we sent FedEx, stating that she could feel free to leave us messages, but all of DH’s responses would be sent in writing by mail. She is at a loss ; ) In the past we used to send her certified mail, but she would not answer the door and then say because of her “medical” issues, she could not get to the post office. Now we send FedEx with indirect signature, which means she can just sign a door tag and they will leave it at her door. No excuses!
Since the beginning, she has terrorized us into thinking that because she is BM her every whim and desire must be met immediately and on her terms. Your site has freed us from that feeling and we are now able to address the issues that are important to the children and ignore everything else. It hasn’t made her any more sane or reasonable, but at least now we feel that we can show what we have been trying to communicate to her regarding her relationship with her children, and that gives us quite a bit of serenity. What a huge power shift! (It also helped that we moved about 18 hours away from her, and don’t have to deal with the drama of her every other weekend visits anymore.)
Ironically, she also complained because DH wasn’t having the boys call “immediately” after she left a message, and that she was to have direct contact with them. So we got them a Skype phone for very little cost per year, unlimited calling, and she leaves them messages. We no longer have to make sure they call her back - she got pissed when they didn’t call her back right away (sometimes it was a week before they did), and she couldn’t complain to DH, because it was her idea! Sometimes, when they hear the phone ring, they see it is her and put the phone back without answering it. They actually talked to her more when DH took her messages and had them call back because we never gave them a choice. I now no longer dread the phone ringing, and actually look forward to her next “drama” message, because we can choose to address it or not, and in our own time. You have saved our sanity!
Sincerely,
CZ
CZ & DH,
No problem and you aren’t the first… and won’t be the last to benefit from this strategy. Not only does it mitigate your insanity… they’re often too stupid to keep from giving you evidence that may be crucial down the road (rages, threats, etc.).
Good for you guys!!!
Sincerely,
Mister-M
June 15th, 2008 at 1:11 pm
I have a question for Mister M or for anyone trying this low contact method. What do you do when the PEW will not respond to anything other than a phone call? She will not provide us with an email and for things that warrant a quick response, then FedEx and snail mail is just not an option. She rarely responds to texts. She waits until DH is picking up or dropping off to approach him with stuff. Or she calls. He just does not want to talk to her unless totally necessary yet she makes it her life goal to get in his face.
Things have gotten a little better as far as she pretty much just won’t tell us anything anymore. LOL. Not really better when we need to know some stuff, but peaceful.
June 16th, 2008 at 7:06 am
I just wanted to wish you a Happy Father’s Day Mister M!! A little late, but I got in late from a flight and I’m just now posting about Father’s Day and wanted to wish you the best!
June 16th, 2008 at 11:57 am
Thank you, Ritchies. Very much.
June 16th, 2008 at 3:56 pm
SC - my initial thoughts is to go with the phone calls and use the “HANG UP IN HER EAR” methodology.
One cross word - hang up.
Off-topic - hang up.
You call, exchange whatever information needs to be exchanged, and that’s it.
He should let all inbound calls go to voice mail. If she has something of an urgent nature that warrants a response - she’ll have to leave a VM and then you can calmly figure out how to approach the response.
Still… this won’t help when you need to document agreements and avoid miscommunications (deliberate or otherwise), so you still may have to deal with issues due to her inability to communicate via documented media.
He should ignore her at exchanges and avoid any verbal confrontations at all costs. It may not seem all that great with the kids nearby, but too much “bad” can happen.
I still say you should continue a campaign to try and force the use of emails whenever possible. For instance, unless it’s an absolute emergency (which is going to be rare) - you just don’t answer or call-back. You fire off an email (assuming you think you know a working address) and tell her - “the primary communication method will be email - the phone will not be used except in emergency situations.”
Keep the contact limited.
June 16th, 2008 at 4:29 pm
SC - I agree with mister-m, emergencies are very rare. If he is the non-custodial parent, it is just as well that she doesn’t tell you anything, because anything to do with drs, school, or extra-curricular activites can be addressed directly with the drs, teachers, coaches/leaders involved. You want to build a relationship on your own with these people anyway.
At pick-ups/drop offs, DH would just stay in the car and the kids would just switch cars, so he rarely had to talk to her then either. If she insists on asking things, have your DH state that he can not give her an answer right away, he has to think about it (or our personal favorite, I will discuss it with my wife (me) and get back to you). She’ll hopefully get the hint that she is not getting an immediate answer anyway. Another option would be to have a third party pick up and drop of the kids, or change the agreement to having the kids picked up and dropped off at school.
We have had to resort to parallel parenting, where she is in charge when they are visiting her and DH is in charge when they are with us. There is no piece of information that we ever have to ask her for, and if she wants something from us, she needs to play by our rules. I’m not sure what kinds of issues you are saying “warrant a quick response”, but if your divorce agreement spells everything out as it should, there should be nothing that requires a quick response. An emergency on her part is not necessarily an emergency for you or the children.
June 17th, 2008 at 12:13 am
Thank you all. When I say warrant a quick response I mean sometimes we need to know information (time and place of something) and she won’t tell us. Sorry if this sounds confusing. We try very very hard to go strictly by the divorce decree, but sometimes “out of the kindness of her heart” lol. She’ll do something like schedule her summer vacation week over Father’s Day (we just dealt with this, this week) and because according to our county rules vacation week takes prescedence over a scheduled holiday. BUT she said we “might” be able to have them for one day on Father’s day weekend and then will not tell us which one, if any, or what times until the very last minute.
In my opinion, I say screw it. It’s not worth dancing her dance just for 6 hours of time with the kids. I say celebrate Father’s day on a different day and let it go. He just wants to see the kids that he hasn’t seen since June 6th.
This is what I mean. He texted her about it and she did not respond that day. He texted her the next day and miracle she decided to respond.
Also all she’ll ever say in voice mail is “call me back” or something along that line. Never if it’s an emergency. Never if it’s just to bitch. He never knows unless he returns the call.
Ok the email thing. I’m trying to make this really short. We had a working email at one point. When she refused to communicate with us about summer vacation( she wouldn’t tell us the weeks she wanted) he sent her 2 emails and she said he was harassing her. Told us she wasn’t using that email anymore and would not supply us with her new one. We finally sent certified mail and this lead to her new husband approaching my husband at his vehicle (with kids in back) and threatening him while his ex wife held open the back door keeping him from being able to leave. I would love to get a court order stating all communications be via email, but don’t even know if that’s possible.
Dragon,
I totally agree with his own relationships with the professionals. I PUSH for it all the time. Thank you both for the wonderful advise!